🇺🇸 Sleep coach: 6 ways, your circadian rhythm can improve your sleep

00:00:03: And that's when we started to see much more higher rates of instances like insomnia, one over a hundred different sleep-wake disorders.

00:00:11: Most people aren't walking outside.

00:00:13: most people are doing their work outside.

00:00:15: I'm setting up my life as much as i possibly can be outside because there is very different hormones and bodily functions happening at different times the day.

00:00:25: so you're creating through this circadian

00:00:26: chaos.

00:00:48: Hi, five guys.

00:00:49: This is Joel and you know as usually on a Feel Good Friday I tend to ask people about health stuff... ...about well-being in all this.

00:00:56: And there's one aspect that really impactful when it comes to wellbeing.. ..and this is sleep.

00:01:01: Also when it come to longevity the way we feel being productive in all of these Sleeps are very important.

00:01:09: There's one great person I actually found across the ocean in the USA, and her name is Molly Eastman.

00:01:15: And Molly has a great company which was called Sleep as A Skill!

00:01:25: Is there something that we could tell people, they sleep better?

00:01:28: She says yes easily.

00:01:30: There are six ways.

00:01:31: your circadian rhythm helps you to sleep better and what this is the circadian rythm will learn of course just as well as these six way.

00:01:38: so Molly it's really great having on show.

00:01:41: Oh!

00:01:41: So great to be here.

00:01:42: I know were chatting before being hit record And i already feel like wildly connected even across the pond so excited for more.

00:01:51: and obviously usually when ive find Founding a company often starts with having a problem on your own or feeling there's the problem that could be solved and no one solves them.

00:02:02: then you go come out dammit.

00:02:03: Then I'm going to start my own.

00:02:04: was it the same here when comes to sleep as skill?

00:02:07: One hundred percent yes, I mean, and I am still to this day shocked that I own a sleep optimization company because it wasn't in the original kind of plans for my life.

00:02:20: It was as the serial entrepreneur living in Manhattan burning the candle at both ends stress-to-the-maxed multiple companies that are juggling initiatives.

00:02:31: And My husband had been together for fifteen years.

00:02:35: so This is kinda beginning our relationship.

00:02:38: but then we took, we had read four hour work week if anyone read Tim Ferriss' book ages ago.

00:02:44: And I decided to let's put everything in storage and get a one-way ticket.

00:02:52: Stress came with us naturally wherever you go there.

00:02:54: You are.

00:02:55: and when I landed in Madrid because we decided, yeah Well let's travel the world but our stress load And responsibilities were surpassing our abilities or if any where?

00:03:08: We were at Abilities.

00:03:10: So when we landed in Madrid, I had just this like oh my god did we make a mistake?

00:03:15: Like and it had been up for all these hours.

00:03:18: And then to start feeling so anxious and had one of my first panic attacks that night!

00:03:24: If anyone's had a panic attack good luck.

00:03:26: kind of sleeping after that... ...and would already have been up at all those hours....so i never really dealt with jet lag or didn't grow up traveling much.

00:03:34: And so then and just in an unfamiliar environment, a lot of unknowns with the no return ticket.

00:03:41: So just the amount of uncertainty was starting to really rise.

00:03:46: Then ensued this relationship to sleep where now I'm not able to count on my sleep in the same way.

00:03:55: Like each night it's like, is it gonna come?

00:03:57: And I start getting more and more anxious about that which i later learned tends to get grouped into this bucket of sleep anxiety.

00:04:04: so fear-of-the-fear...like Is It Gonna Come?

00:04:06: Am I not going to be able to

00:04:07: sleep?".

00:04:09: And I did everything NOT TO DO thereafter you know.

00:04:11: So I would try to get sleep anytime I could.

00:04:14: poor circadian rhythm had no semblance of what time it was, what was going on.

00:04:20: And so I shifted things more and more into the state of chaos.

00:04:24: So eventually go to the doctors at this point we're in Croatia and leave with a prescription for sleeping pills and just know real plan.

00:04:33: In that moment is such fear but also desperation like i want to sleep!

00:04:41: you know, what am I gonna do to get out of this?

00:04:44: Is it just going be my new life when i come from a family with mental health issues and saw heavy pharmaceutical use.

00:04:51: So in that moment, it was like is this the beginning of when I start going down That path and have my life look like some of those things.

00:04:58: They had seen so there's a lot of fear Bubbling and boiling And so-so.

00:05:04: It became clear to me that I was gonna have to figure This out on my own based on because later went too many doctors.

00:05:12: I want doctors in Croatia Budapest Italy but end all of them Unfortunately sort of the same thing just handing out.

00:05:21: I'm sure they would like to share, but unfortunately in the United States anyway.

00:05:25: The average doctor even on a Harvard med gets about two hours of training and sleep so They don't have A lot of information to really Share.

00:05:33: And So it became very obvious that i'm gonna need To figure this out?

00:05:43: So I just absurdly went down the rabbit hole to see, you know what is this thing called sleep and What does it take to have workability here?

00:05:55: And the things that I discovered completely changed of course in my life.

00:06:23: Thankfully able to reliably sleep great and work with all kinds of other people on helping them support their sleep.

00:06:29: We have a top sleep podcast with, you know over two hundred and fifty episodes.

00:06:34: With different sleep experts.

00:06:35: we were writing a Sleep Obsessions newsletter for over seven years sharing about all kinds of things that can help people with their sleep.

00:06:43: We've online courses.

00:06:44: I have a niche in high stakes poker so i work on the ton up High Stakes Poker players which is really interesting group.

00:06:50: they're designed... They are living not living-in but sort of spending time at casinos designing purpose to confuse the circadian rhythm right?

00:06:59: you're awake for sure.

00:07:00: And, we have a very large ORE ring database.

00:07:04: so we've been working with ORE's platform for many years to get to see just countless individuals of what really stands out and where people are faring how they're relating their sleep in the results.

00:07:17: So I share all that not like laundry lists those things but underscore if anyone listening is dealing whether just anywhere on the spectrum of mild frustration with their sleep to out and out panic, which was where I was at.

00:07:33: Or maybe considering that there might be something available in their sleep they haven't really considered.

00:07:40: Wherever you may fall from your sleep my offering is everything not to do.

00:07:48: It's like the cautionary tale and yet can have this level of confidence in his ability skillset, that anything is possible for anyone.

00:07:59: And it's really only been this great book called Mapping the Darkness that looks at history of sleep as a domain, an area study.

00:08:17: It came into vogue around industrial revolution when we all went indoors and people under electric lights started to see higher rates like insomnia one over hundred different sleep wake disorders.

00:08:34: And so I think that there's an exciting kind of sleep renaissance coming where we're starting to uncover the many things That might be lurking with our sleep, that We might have just no idea about.

00:08:46: and this is something.

00:08:47: We do a third Of Our lives on average twenty six years at our entire life for gonna Be asleep.

00:08:52: So it would behoove us To take A little time like We're doing today to look At It.

00:08:56: and i mean what?

00:08:57: I Like About This.

00:08:58: What But Jesus said Is I couldn't imagine that there are quite a few people, but first of all do not know.

00:09:04: it's possible to optimize this.

00:09:06: To do something about it?

00:09:07: Totally!

00:09:08: Second of all might feel ashamed and have never talked about it.

00:09:11: And third of all you just said more than hundreds different sleep disorders.

00:09:16: i was thinking of working in shifts for instance.

00:09:19: if they're working at night sleeping on the day It's so easy that they get confused when it comes to sleep.

00:09:24: So this is really about giving hope as well, thank you for this and let's dive into it!

00:09:29: I mean we just said the circadian aspect like... You name it.

00:09:33: there's a circadian rhythm.

00:09:36: Let us give people an understanding of what exactly?

00:09:38: Yeah if you think of this word People likely have heard of circadian rythm in reference to sleep.

00:09:45: Oh okay something about sleep Maybe something about travel Is often kind of what we hear.

00:09:50: It's so much more.

00:09:52: what's so fascinating is that it this rhythm and circa about twenty four hours.

00:09:59: And when we lived outside in nature and were connected to the rhythms of nature just intrinsically then a lot of this really got handled.

00:10:08: some other things i'm gonna talk today.

00:10:10: If you were to be so bold as pretty much move outside and spend most of your life outdoors, a lot of this would just sort work.

00:10:19: Now because we have not done that... We have gone indoors and in the United States, sorry I had a lot of United States references.

00:10:27: But the EPA did do a study in two thousand one and found that the average American we could assume that this extrapolates to other developed societies That spending well over ninety percent Of their time indoors.

00:10:42: And it was in twenty-one before our pandemic Before work from home revolution smartphones Netflix all things.

00:10:48: It's probably a lot more now.

00:10:50: But we would see that breakdown to in buildings, so your home space or workspace and automobiles.

00:10:56: So you know car what have.

00:10:59: And that's a problem, because those enclosures divorce us from all these signals.

00:11:06: That we're going to talk about in the signals.

00:11:08: like.

00:11:09: our most basic of terms are light dark not just for like a nice have but form a biological hard wiring.

00:11:23: So it makes sense that there would be such a heavy weight to light dark because of this and we know out chronobiology, the science of time and how time affects our biology.

00:11:43: That it appears that light dark is the highest weight.

00:11:47: you can say a much better than I can.

00:11:50: zeitgeber because here's as much... Zeitgeber!

00:11:53: Yes exactly The German pronunciation for that German word is beautiful.

00:11:59: So another sort of word for a Time Q or Time Giver And so we've got all these time givers.

00:12:07: Tell our body something about what time it is and want to be doing when this most obvious one we take a long haul trip if anyone has experience that.

00:12:17: thankfully luckily after my whole sleep in travel debacle.

00:12:21: My husband I were able to successfully start traveling for about three years right before covid end you know back-and-forth.

00:12:28: so they would have trips whatever, forty hours or something.

00:12:31: So you would have to really hone in on some of these tools and so that's the most acute and obvious.

00:12:38: but we're doing that every single day based on what were exposing ourselves or not exposing our selves

00:12:44: too.".

00:12:45: You mentioned there are around six.

00:12:49: This is how we run things at sleep as a skills kind of through this order of priority.

00:12:54: Well, I want to order the priority but i would say that We know that particularly these top ones im gonna mention are really heavily weighted so that light dark Is so impactful and it will impact all The other things than Im talking about because if you You know, stay in a dark room.

00:13:12: To twenty four seven we're gonna see physiological effects on you.

00:13:16: We're going to see hormonal shifts changes in your melatonin and cortisol Your mood all kinds of things.

00:13:22: I mean that's just so obvious.

00:13:23: But then we forget That were kind of doing Things like that day-to-day today by living In our little boxes And not realizing the major impact this is having.

00:13:35: So there are really cool apps Like i suggest people get one that i really like it called circadian app.

00:13:40: And what you do is, it will geotag you where you are and so then you'll get clear on what time sunrise point that out to you.

00:14:07: so you can prioritize certain bands of this light, but then you can also test the lux in the environment.

00:14:14: So like if I was to test it here usually It's quite low.

00:14:19: Also by the way red If anyone can see the video read a light on the old phone.

00:14:25: But The app will test the Luxe In your Environment and most luck i have tons Of windows in This space?

00:14:32: But let's See what Will come Out.

00:14:34: thirty six Lux.

00:14:36: that is a problem because Because if you think about what the body needs to be told What time it isn't want me doing when?

00:14:45: If I was just walk outside, I can assure You would be.

00:14:49: It's very cloudy day.

00:14:50: We talked about this for where we're gonna film this podcast But it's a very cloudy Day so we could even on the cloudy days still usually get two six thousand seven thousand and we'd have to double check right.

00:15:00: but then And that's for early, you know it still morning over here and then as the day goes on.

00:15:07: Then when we get to solar noon one of sun is directly above view than there are.

00:15:12: times certainly hear an Austin that can get a well-over hundred thousand locks.

00:15:17: so that is thirty six lock versus a will.

00:15:21: ever hundred thousand looks at.

00:15:23: most people aren't walking outside most people art you know, doing their work outside.

00:15:28: I'm setting up my life as much as i possibly can to be outside.

00:15:31: so bring my laptop out there.

00:15:33: sometimes it's uncomfortable sometime this is loud sometimes its windy but It will make the difference on My mood or sleep and so much right?

00:15:44: And So that Is what we're talking about when We talk About light is how To really live Outside of kind Of The norms What You might normally see in our environment and also educate ourselves On This whole idea of sleeping skill set.

00:15:55: This is a skillset, the physics of light and understanding just how much of difference this makes for well-being.

00:16:02: so you're doing that And then on second half You are going into darkness.

00:16:06: That's whole other thing.

00:16:08: most people aren't hanging out in either.

00:16:11: Okay now I got little anxious because my office is even below earth.

00:16:15: So we have three floors.

00:16:18: Well

00:16:19: your nice and grounded.

00:16:20: at least.

00:16:22: No EMFs probably are like low EMF so that's great.

00:16:26: Okay, but I guess we'll find solutions for that.

00:16:29: maybe let's just dive into the six different dimensions.

00:16:32: So what is the first dimension?

00:16:33: you look at it sleep as a skill?

00:16:35: Yeah Great.

00:16:36: well in case anyone else is anxious by What i just said him very conscious of anxiety because i've spent A lot of my life and there.

00:16:43: so if Anyone Else Is feeling That instead i hope that i can offer The knowledge that this Totally work, but the body is resilient and we can dip in.

00:16:54: And this what I do my poker players there in casinos that have no windows.

00:16:57: it's all blue light.

00:16:58: It's all crazy right?

00:17:00: But we set them up for success to get them outside kind of as much As possibly Ken.

00:17:05: so That almost same way that member back on a day when people smoke they would have like smoke breaks get outside.

00:17:12: They would always figure out a way to get

00:17:13: inside.".

00:17:14: We're trying to have the same level of commitment, so we can get ourselves outside for sun as much as possible throughout the course of day.

00:17:21: Now if you are in certain latitudes or environmental architecture setups like your speaking to underground there is faux options that technology and technological advancements.

00:17:35: There are lights that, for instance you can produce vitamin D from a light which is pretty crazy.

00:17:41: Those actually popped up into popularity during COVID because of the connection with vitamin D and viral load.

00:17:49: so one is called mitolux another ones called spurty lamp Another one's called chroma d but all these are Light sources That you could use.

00:17:59: The one I'm using most often if i am in like northern latitude locations Is called mito lux because just easy and you can get kind of a nice full spectrum band up light.

00:18:11: So, You could have something like that.

00:18:12: if your long day podcasting are downstairs or under underground then use it anyway.

00:18:18: Okay I'll

00:18:19: link them to the show notes by the way.

00:18:23: Yes!

00:18:28: levels because we're also finding that just taking vitamin D capsules or, you know supplements is missing some of the conversation about what we do need.

00:18:38: That the sun giving us where not necessarily getting from supplement.

00:18:41: so...that can be supportive.

00:18:44: So out those six things We talked about light dark being most important and impactful top one We're also within there, we are making sure that our sleep wake cycle is connected to the light dark.

00:18:59: That's hinged in here.

00:19:01: so as much you possibly can align with the rhythms of nature and see unequivocally this makes a difference.

00:19:09: both fall asleep or stay asleep more anchored with sun rise than sunset say, although there... There could.

00:19:22: there is if available in your lifestyle and If you can make that happen reliably, it's all about reliability inconsistency with sleep.

00:19:30: So we don't want to say oh I'm gonna rise of the sun on Monday But come Saturday.

00:19:36: I'm going to sleep until nine like We don't Want all of that variability?

00:19:42: You are setting up and then you're doing that consistently as much as you possibly can, right?

00:19:54: So that's connected with those that light dark.

00:19:56: Then we're moving into temperature timing And so this is really interesting in that our body temperature is not fixed.

00:20:03: It is very dynamic throughout the course of the day and into the night ability to drop sufficiently in body temperature.

00:20:22: So we start to take stock of what some of those things could be, but also the ambient temperature and your space.

00:20:27: so We're looking too.

00:20:29: Yeah go ahead.

00:20:30: actually I'm just about two step on the break for Just a second because yeah different Things you said are so full Of stuff And would love to explore them In more detail?

00:20:40: If it's okay with You Let's Go back To number one For A Second As well.

00:20:46: Light and dark is step number one, then you had like sleep work cycle.

00:20:49: This was number two on.

00:20:49: so if we stick to this one So what I learned already?

00:20:53: Is that you have this UVA uvb uva And then sundown rhythm at day.

00:20:59: Yes

00:21:00: where i should look for being outside as much As possible and If i cannot i can use One of these lamps These artificial lights right

00:21:08: sure

00:21:10: Okay, is there anything else to it?

00:21:12: when It comes To the light part Of The light darkness equation

00:21:15: A lot.

00:21:16: Yes, there is a lot of lots.

00:21:19: so you know I've spent multiple podcast episodes just with different light experts essentially or people that are informed on quantum biology circadian rhythm and treatment.

00:21:30: So there's a lot to be said about.

00:21:32: but at its most basic terms we're looking for brighter days And darker nights because what were finding?

00:21:40: there was a study, not a study.

00:21:42: There is scientific consensus.

00:21:44: that was released just couple years ago with almost two hundred and fifty circadian scientists referencing over two thousand seven hundred peer reviewed publications.

00:21:54: they are all calling for warning labels on our basic light bulbs when used at night.

00:22:00: part of why their doing now?

00:22:02: it's because the refining course impacts on sleep But also things like mental health issues, looking at diabetes.

00:22:15: So metabolic health and all these other deleterious health effects just simply by the use of electric lights that night.

00:22:24: so they're calling for this warning labels to be very well might see in the future.

00:22:28: Warning labels are same way we might on like cigarettes or what have you?

00:22:31: And so-so.

00:22:32: there is a show that it's because The average with days quoted in that scientific consensus was that The average day for you know standard individual is around a hundred times to dim like when i showed you that's thirty six percent lux.

00:22:46: it's far too damn.

00:22:48: To get the signals at we need so run one hundred times two dem as compared to a normal sunny day, and around a hundred times too bright in our evenings as compared to the brightest moonlit evening.

00:23:01: So we're basically living upside down, and this is creating upside-down results with their sleep where a lot of us are drifting much later than and a lot of variability in our sleep.

00:23:16: And both of those things we see make negative impacts on our health and well-being, so we want to get brighter days darker nights that can take a lot.

00:23:28: setting up because this, we're going to remove those bands of blue and green as much as possible.

00:23:44: Particularly blue in the evenings and high lux output that might be all littered throughout especially even above which is a confusing signal because usually light from above from solar noon.

00:24:00: so you can see why chaos would there at what time it was when cells are trying hormones and bodily functions that are happening at different times of the day.

00:24:13: So you're creating sort this circadian chaos And that's where, you know.

00:24:17: So setting up your environment for success as much as possible.

00:24:20: but when you're in environments you can't control You could bring out say like orange lens blue blockers or red lens Blue Blocker But not unfortunately the clear.

00:24:29: Or are they yellow?

00:24:30: They're Not really going to do enough In the evenings.

00:24:33: so...so you have To kind of Do a little bit Of learning and research on some These topics.

00:24:39: But what does your day look like?

00:24:41: I mean, if you just said okay my-my Day should get brighter.

00:24:45: Does this means You're really working outside?

00:24:47: because This isn't obviously not an option for everyone?

00:24:51: Yes i know.

00:24:52: yes

00:24:53: Is it?

00:24:53: is it enough to fight by one of these artificial lights?

00:24:56: put It on My table and you Know Just go full throttle On it.

00:24:59: or is there something else I could do To make my day brighter?

00:25:02: Yeah, really good points and it was much harder sharing with you when I lived downtown.

00:25:08: It's like a whole obstacle to get the amount of light that i'm able.

00:25:13: Um, so you're right.

00:25:15: There's all kinds of hindrances and we might have certain jobs that could make this harder.

00:25:20: So what were trying to do is yes there are certain light groups That Are Trying To Mimic As Much as Possible The Sun And This Is There'S Different Aspects Of This.

00:25:31: So Like the One I Told You About That lets out UVB.

00:25:35: that one you have to be can only kind of have exposure.

00:25:37: Of that one for a few minutes throughout the day because it's like burn you essentially cuz its ability.

00:25:44: there is very drug-like effect with UVB.

00:25:47: And that's why, with vitamin D there is a certain amount and it also depends on your skin tone.

00:25:52: so this is your Fitzpatrick scale of where you fall for like I'm Irish So much paler...so can take less sun whereas if we go further down On the spectrum If someone from Africa have darker skin tones they're going to need more exposure.

00:26:12: So this is where just getting more aware of this and something like that.

00:26:15: my circadian app can help you kind make sense at this for your specific skin tone.

00:26:21: And other things.

00:26:23: so the point is, we have to take some finessing.

00:26:26: so what I'm doing throughout is to set myself outside as much as possible.

00:26:30: So I have this podcast here, so then i move my self-outside for you know... My next set of calls or what have you?

00:26:37: But not everyone can do that!

00:26:39: Instead if we could sort the sun breaks and we dip ourselves out side periodically.

00:26:45: And We did have a top researcher Dr Sachin Panda Out Of The Sulk Institute on the Podcasts in some his research found that getting at least about an hour outside each day seemed to help make a difference, to create melatonin at night.

00:27:01: And this is where the very real cause and effect seems to occur—that we cannot seem to CREATE sufficient melatonine if we don't spend enough time outside!

00:27:11: Now...this could shift a little bit throughout different periods of year…where you are in the globe….you know there's number things but Can you set your days up at bare minimum to spend about an hour outside?

00:27:23: And from a lot of people, that would be a big breakthrough.

00:27:26: Then that helps you make the melatonin at night and it also helps you dip down your cortisol so that you can have that melatoninsurge in the evening.

00:27:35: So these things are all interconnected.

00:27:39: Okay!

00:27:39: To go full circle because we said its' also dark at night.

00:27:43: Would this mean no TV in the evenings blue blocker glasses, sleeping mask.

00:27:50: What does your day look like so that it's still workable when you have kids?

00:27:54: When do you have a job and would like to enjoy stuff?

00:27:57: Oh yeah!

00:27:57: A hundred percent.

00:27:58: oh my gosh... My husband and I love the office.

00:28:01: we watch The Office reruns or whatever at night totally for me.

00:28:07: i just throw on Blue Blockers.

00:28:08: he did the same And there are covers that you can get for your way.

00:28:13: My husband is a total no-for-this, but some people do the covers for their TV so that you're blocking a lot of the blue light.

00:28:22: I Do The Blue Blockers?

00:28:24: But my whole environment has like... No!

00:28:28: There's these hockey puck style lights in here because it's new house and we just never use them to forgive some because they are really, like talk about cortisol inducing.

00:28:40: And so we have just our own sort of night style lights.

00:28:44: So you can get Edison bulbs You can get Himalayan salt lamps red light Red lights being separate from red life therapy?

00:28:53: That's a little bit different.

00:28:55: but And then some people use candles and other things.

00:28:58: So you can measure those with that same app I was showing you, see the luxe in our environment... Our goal is about seven luxes or so!

00:29:08: We're trying to keep it at this range because light bulbs have only been around for a little over one hundred forty-five years.

00:29:18: In span of human history we would never have encountered that much light at night And also would have been expensive, so you'd be buying all these candles.

00:29:28: So there was already hindrance or lanterns and oil and all of this things.

00:29:35: Just because it's normal now doesn't mean that its' normal

00:29:38: always.".

00:29:40: Awesome!

00:29:41: I feel like the first dimension is pretty checked.

00:29:44: then we're talking about the sleepwake cycle?

00:29:47: Well, I'm glad to say that... We spend some time on those four.

00:29:52: a reason because it is the heaviest weight to everything else we're talking about and then impacts all of other things that I will mention.

00:30:00: So, there are ones where you can go through quicker the amount of serotonin, dopamine.

00:30:11: We are designed to be sort of addicted to the sun because we have a feel-good effect when we're exposed to that sunlight continually and see how it impacts all these other things.

00:30:22: so if you look at temperature timing...the fact our body temperature is dynamic starts rising during our REM cycles in early morning hours rising, rising getting to kind of peek throughout the course.

00:30:43: And that's where things like cooling mattress toppers can make a big difference, sleeping really cool as much as you can.

00:30:54: But if you think about nature... You would have been sleeping on the ground which will be in the coolest part of the environment.

00:31:00: I mean the ground could get very cold and it is almost natural cooling mattress topper.

00:31:08: so we're trying to mimic this in these weird man-made beds.

00:31:14: no one lived for such long stretch And they tend to insulate and kind of trap the heat within them.

00:31:22: So you're kinda cooking in there, on these duvets and foam and all that stuff.

00:31:26: so... The cooling mattress stoppers as much as you can cool it down I promise could make such a difference with your sleep results and measurably sew too!

00:31:35: We are aiming for that nice arc temperature shift then one below.

00:31:40: is temperature.

00:31:41: or is meal timing and type, I have a continuous glucose monitor on right now.

00:31:47: Just one second about the sleeping thing...I need to ask this one!

00:31:49: It's hard when my wife will kill me but usually there are things that women always freeze while they sleep.

00:31:56: guys you know?

00:31:57: They're always sweating.

00:31:58: it's literally like this i was changing my blankets because it was too thick.

00:32:03: My wife has two thicker ones where still shirt and trousers And she's still freezing.

00:32:11: I mean, what is this about?

00:32:14: What's

00:32:14: going on there.

00:32:15: Yeah!

00:32:15: Oh my God... There are so much there.

00:32:17: and This why i want people to really get the message that sleep Is a skill.

00:32:21: it not just like use some lavender And you know write your worries Like there was SO MUCH TO IT.

00:32:27: So thank You.

00:32:29: N One Women.

00:32:33: If you were to invest in these cooling mattress toppers, that's a nice thing just for relationships because then one side can put it whatever temperature want.

00:32:40: The other side could put into what ever temperatures they want!

00:32:42: But then I would also, if we were looking to optimize for both parties what i'd want to do is also test because there's sometimes going be shifts in hormones and different types of times throughout the cycle.

00:32:54: If we're menstruating age thyroid health iron health other things that affect thermoregulation at another big factor of thermal regulation unfortunately a lot of women you know aren't getting What?

00:33:06: Would make such A difference For this shift which Is muscle mass And strength training.

00:33:12: So... As much as we can support that muscle building, that's a big factor for the ability to thermoregulate.

00:33:20: Also brown fat.

00:33:21: so when you see these stories of like in Scandinavian countries putting their kids outside and the snow and letting them sleep people think they're insane.

00:33:29: And yet We see babies have so much more Brown fat Which is very mitochondrial dense.

00:33:35: So everything I'm talking about Is to support Mitochondrial health.

00:33:38: There's an argument You want To become kind Of A mitocondriac To Sleep Well feel well, age-well etc.

00:33:45: So you want to support your mitochondria.

00:33:47: and so for babies that have a lot of that brown fat they are much able to handle cold temperatures as what we see with like cold therapy how that can help build more grow more Brown fats or whoever men.

00:34:03: And there's a whole thing about the cold.

00:34:06: I know this is like, along... There are lots to these things.

00:34:09: but we see that it was such problem because women were being told oh well you can't be around so much cold and what have you?

00:34:17: We're very living outside with men for many thousands of years.

00:34:22: So act as if running away from cold is doing us such disservice.

00:34:28: You know be subjecting ourselves to harmful temperatures or some sort of thing in the realm of like cold spathing and what have you.

00:34:36: But even to be outside in the cold, especially if your in a northern latitude location that makes it different.

00:34:41: so thats an element this mitochondrial health.

00:34:44: So its is big topic but at the bare minimum If we were do sort of the different cooling mattress stoppers At first part of each party can kind shift accordingly.

00:34:55: The other thing we see too often people might go bed cold But then they might wake up in the early morning hours, hot.

00:35:03: And so we see that a ton with people because also our body temperature is starting to rise when you go into REM and as kind of... The theory is that it might almost be preparing us for an awake state.

00:35:16: cause would very jarring from deep sleep where your cold and this rich delta-sleep will all sudden be woken up.

00:35:24: if anyone's been woken your body temperature started to go up and you're seeing all these dreams.

00:35:32: And, You are starting turn on the body.

00:35:35: so it's much less of a jarring experience than going into an awake state.

00:35:39: but that can also affect body temperature as well.

00:35:43: Maybe I was too slow in listening But is there ideal temperature?

00:35:46: I should look for in my sleeping room because In Germany i was told its like nineteen degrees Celsius which is around about sixty-six degrees Fahrenheit.

00:35:56: Is this correct or is it also an individual thing?

00:35:59: Yes, that's very in the realm we're looking for.

00:36:03: Apologies to keep bringing us US-centric things but The Sleep Foundation suggests aiming between sixty and sixty seven degrees Fahrenheit.

00:36:14: so doing a little math.

00:36:16: Fifteen to ninety degrees when it comes to Celsius okay

00:36:19: Yeah, so very cool much cooler than a lot of people might be doing.

00:36:24: and Of course we're again.

00:36:25: We're not trying to make everyone wildly uncomfortable because if you're super freezing that could be disruptive too.

00:36:31: But ideally were kind of edging our way into a cooler ambient environment And over time.

00:36:39: We start to.

00:36:39: we tend to adjust and the measurable things That you'll tend to see on your wearables whether aura woo bio strap whatever you are using is that your heart rate tends to go down.

00:36:49: Your HRD, Heart Rate Variability, tends to up.

00:36:53: often the sleep stages improve and less wake-ups throughout the course of the night.

00:36:58: so you're starting.

00:36:59: just see a lot factors also respiratory rates going down too which is big factor for nervous system rejuvenation next day.

00:37:08: And now speaking about temperature, I mean there's a nice way to slide over the other aspect that I just interrupted you with.

00:37:14: I also witnessed when i'm eating food too late... ...that im really sweating in the night because obviously I guess the liver is working and then the whole digestion system this is like burning calories probably creates heat.

00:37:27: so we were talking about meal times and digestion.

00:37:31: what it should look for?

00:37:34: Yeah, exactly.

00:37:36: So we're looking for... Can we align that?

00:37:40: We are largely eating within the rhythms of nature so when the sun is out it's largely when you're eating and when the Sun has set its largely when your not eating which is very doable obviously to people in summer.

00:37:52: but were actually be able handle what we see during winter months where the Sun sets much earlier Can you reliably largely stop eating at around that time.

00:38:03: That's known as circadian rhythm, intermittent fasting and it is not really a long fast.

00:38:08: its just giving little bit of digestive break in the evening.

00:38:11: so compared to been very invoked for last few years to skip breakfast.

00:38:17: And then, and I used to do that too years back i would be so proud of myself and i would like want a medal to push my meal as late as i could go!

00:38:26: When i feel very superior to everyone else because haha...i don't need to eat and yet i didn't have any clue what i was doing?

00:38:35: To my hormonal balance especially for women these long kind of fast can be problematic if you're menstruating age but even beyond that your throwing off the rhythms.

00:38:45: What we want to do instead is can we front load things?

00:38:48: And if you're gonna skip any meal, Can We make it more your dinner or kind of Instead of like brunch being breakfast lunch.

00:38:55: Could we Make It Kind Of a Lunch Dinner Being Like A Linner Or Something Right So Kind Of Moving That A Little Bit Earlier and We See that at the Bare Minimum.

00:39:04: The Most Conservative Call Out Is Having Your Last Bit of Food Around Three Hours Before Bed.

00:39:08: But I Would Argue what We're Seeing On The Ground With Wearable Data Is That We Have Much Better Results when people push things even earlier than that, so four or five hours before bed sometimes more.

00:39:20: But bio-individual and I would also caution for women of menstruating age optimizing for fertility just making sure you give yourself both to a little bit out window but not overly pushing it fast too long.

00:39:36: I was just thinking about all these hot countries like Spain, Italy, you know, Mexico.

00:39:42: They usually start to eat at ten

00:39:44: p.m.,

00:39:45: like real masses of food.

00:39:47: that should be really bad then?

00:39:50: Yes yeah and we could see it!

00:39:51: We can measure with their wearables.

00:39:54: And if people go in lab but the problem within lab is You're not seeing what an average day looks Like for People.

00:40:01: That's What Is So Beautiful About These Wearables years of data, what people actually live like.

00:40:09: And so whoop had a study... I was speaking with the team and don't believe they've released it yet but they were alluding to looking at thousands of participants wearing book bans two hours before bed having last bit of food versus four hours beforehand have been lost by the food on the four hour before that.

00:40:29: having a market improvements in many aspects health and sleep.

00:40:35: And so another way you can measure this is, you put on a continuous glucose monitor.

00:40:39: So I have one right now.

00:40:41: and what's fascinating then?

00:40:44: If a lot of the reasons people come our way is that they're annoyed by wake-ups.

00:40:48: They are waking up throughout the course in night, can't fall back asleep.

00:40:51: it's really annoying.

00:40:52: and now there over at... And one other reason for wake ups many many many however popular when not allowed to realize is metabolic health.

00:41:01: so we put on a cgm continuous glucose monitor.

00:41:05: then might see their glucose dropping both day into the night because how ever you have my day gets mirrored nights, however you're at by day gets mirrored in your night's both for stress load metabolic health etc.

00:41:19: So if you're spiking and crashing all day long You can almost guarantee you're gonna see more of that at night.

00:41:24: And that's going to often result In wakeups because the body is in a bit of a stressed state To navigate all that.

00:41:30: and now when you are stressed it's harder to fall back asleep.

00:41:34: so we've got bi-directional problem because now you're not sleeping enough, and now your more stressed.

00:41:40: And now your glucose is at a higher resting level the next day.

00:41:44: Now you are making kind of crappier choices... ...and it just keeps snowballing!

00:41:48: It gets worse and worse in compounds until we start peeling back the layers.

00:41:52: That totally makes sense.

00:41:53: that sounds as if the body wakes up Because its hungry kind off.

00:41:56: You know these tips?

00:41:57: Yeah Totally, exactly.

00:42:00: And then what's so cool about that is when we have the awareness—again a U.S.

00:42:04: staff but as a US... The average American is….

00:42:06: We find around ninety-three percent of Americans having some form metabolic dysfunction and granted we know America particularly dealing with health issues abounds right?

00:42:17: So far it was optimal But we could assume many progressive countries are dealing with these problems of metabolic health.

00:42:27: When I say progressive I don't mean it like that.

00:42:57: There's even a huge study in nature that found that just eight thousand steps a day was supported for many aspects of health, including things like sleep apnea which is a huge problem.

00:43:07: In the world of sleep and many people don't know they have it.

00:43:11: so thats why we do test every person.

00:43:14: So just basic walking can make such a difference.

00:43:19: that will also impact.

00:43:20: And cause.

00:43:20: part of our goal is to lower your average resting heart rate while you're sleeping and support heart rate variability, and lower respiratory rate and all these things.

00:43:30: one of the clearest paths to that often is through exercise and muscle mass.

00:43:35: so body comp I like to do with my clients too.

00:43:37: it's would get dexa scans and see what are we dealing with for muscle mass versus fat mass because all those things can play role end can play rolling how we're breathing.

00:43:47: So when we do gain weight, We can often have deposits.

00:43:50: that's why look at next circumference for sleep apnea as one of the things.

00:43:54: not only thing is there was tons slender people That are dealing with breathing abnormalities but it also play a role in effect hormones and so you Can develop sleep disorders where they were no sleep Disorders As we kind of lose some of that workability With our body?

00:44:10: So exercise timing.

00:44:11: And There's Also A big study that will appear to nature and they found that at least four hours before bed for exercise.

00:44:21: I know, I mentioned this for food but also for exercise for the last time of like high intensity For most factors of sleep.

00:44:28: But then if you want to be conservative They've found six hours for all factors Of sleep.

00:44:34: so those would be things that you could kind of play with To see what can work for you?

00:44:38: You know.

00:44:38: So the people that come home from work And then they're like well i'm gonna go do Like a high-intensity out or something.

00:44:45: We want to see.

00:44:45: is there ways that we could shuffle some of that and shift, maybe different times throughout your day?

00:44:50: Or make your evening workout a lighter kind of yoga or something more calming?

00:44:56: I was just thinking about my soccer times And I just realized we were always training at seven

00:45:01: p.m.,

00:45:02: and even under lights, so for two hours or so... Totally!

00:45:07: ...and then afterwards you would eat something.

00:45:09: So this is totally counter-intuitive to what she said?

00:45:13: Yes,

00:45:14: it's so common

00:45:15: right?!

00:45:15: People become a way of life but over time they're not sleeping as well.

00:45:22: things are thrown off those nights maybe hard or fall asleep stay asleep so that you start skewing out later across the board and just kind of becomes this natural thing.

00:45:30: So yeah, if we can peel back some of these layers... And the more we educate on this, the more as a society hopefully we can help kinda make ourselves a bit more circadian aligned?

00:45:39: Can we start The Soccer Games little earlier or put it in the weekends or whatever?

00:45:43: do you know what I mean?

00:45:44: Obviously there's certain constraints but the more that we learn about real impacts health well-being i think people are interested.

00:45:54: So that would be the exercise timing piece.

00:45:56: And I can also act as another zeitgeber or time-giver to the body if we pull that earlier, so it can be wake promoting too work out and move the body when the sun is out.

00:46:08: That kind of help back this sort of natural coffee If you will get your moving and getting awake until the body's daytime.

00:46:15: Then then look at thought timing.

00:46:18: I refer to as thought timing because we have new research that appears at our thoughts look, as if they exist on a circadian rhythm.

00:46:27: So there's really cool study called the Mind After Midnight.

00:46:30: We had lead researchers on now in the podcast If anyone wants to Look In Deeper.

00:46:35: But what they found is that The Thoughts That We Would Have after midnight or whatever your wee hours of the morning are for you would be actually very flawed...I shouldn't say flawed but it'd more.

00:46:46: black and white have unfortunately more catastrophic results as far as high suicidality rates showing up in the wee hours of the mornings, people taking action on these thoughts even though bucket.

00:47:09: So if we can get ourselves to know this information and then almost create like a contract with themselves, not trust those thoughts that are yapping at three AM... If we just make our selves- Get ourselves into the morning!

00:47:24: We have a trust it will likely be of whole different tinge.

00:47:29: I'm

00:47:29: smiling because they also witnessed that sometimes when i am awake at night and come up with an idea,

00:47:53: Brainstate and so the knowledge of this can be really impactful.

00:47:57: So then you want to support like my husband will yell at me, uh At night And he'll be like is this good thought timing?

00:48:03: because then I'll try to be like yeah Oh let's talk about whatever.

00:48:07: some big trip we're gonna take right before bed?

00:48:09: Like that's going to be activating even on a positive side if You're excited About something or maybe your stressed about Something but Then you just go and check Your email Right Before Bed.

00:48:18: There Is A knowing That that can have real-world impact on brain state, activation state cortisol and things that kind of impact.

00:48:28: the ability for high melatonin pulse we're after at

00:48:33: night.

00:48:33: The situation you described when it came to Madrid is being in a different place... Yes!

00:48:40: ...and I sometimes witnessed At night, it could be the same that sometimes you feel like more dangerous.

00:48:45: You know?

00:48:45: It's like okay what is going on?

00:48:47: I'm a little bit more sensitive in this so i can totally imagine there's difference between thoughts of day and thought at the night.

00:48:54: And maybe just one last thing about the fifth aspect because we're talking about exercise timing & type still spinning around my mind.

00:49:04: What type sports should I do or exercises at which hour?

00:49:10: Yeah, so that loop study I was mentioning is really helpful because it kind of looks at these high intensity type activities.

00:49:19: Unfortunately, probably the soccer would likely fall in there unless we're very casual soccer.

00:49:26: We are on a proverbial bench or something but for most of us yeah it's going to be activating.

00:49:31: so whoop found that these high intensity you know the crossfits or whatever That we want.

00:49:38: try and regulate those at least four hours before bed.

00:49:42: And then also if we're dealing with certain aspects of sleep, they did find certain parts of sleep.

00:49:46: Also being impacted even six hours before bed.

00:49:49: so someone's struggling and want to just be conservative kind in the beginning of your day trying to help peak your cortisol, because that's where you have your highest cortisol.

00:50:05: peak is first thing.

00:50:06: In the morning it's supposed be set up but you're looking for a Goldilocks not too high and like overly stressed and not too low And so some people might have kind of flat-lined their cortisol.

00:50:17: That can another way into getting exercise first thing.

00:50:21: But if we're too stressed out, and you are going into like blue lit gyms.

00:50:25: And all these things then there could be an argument for moving it a little bit later in your day finding at times... Like In Your Afternoon when your body is warmed up.

00:50:34: that's what athletes will do less likelihood of injury so You can kind of play around with It.

00:50:38: but certainly That We Are Not Going Too Late Into The Day Now.

00:50:41: that doesn't mean that gentle movement like Gentle Yoga or Light Walk Or Those Sort Of Things Couldn'T Actually Help Lower stress and that can be supported for people

00:50:57: in the evening.

00:51:18: And so he studied the Hudson tribe in Africa and looked at their sleep.

00:51:24: He would find that, well one they're wildly active.

00:51:28: So they were moving around especially the men on the tribe because they were hunter-gatherers.

00:51:33: you know said They're walking In the teens if not over twenty thousand steps a day like tons of movement.

00:51:39: The women also moving a lot kind of when the lower teens was what I recall seeing.

00:51:44: and it's a lot Of activity cuz there outside you know, creating a workable tribe essentially.

00:51:52: So we do not want to be hindering that movement and fortunately we're seeing it for ourselves galore just lot of sedentary lifestyle And thats creating big problem for alot aspects.

00:52:02: health cause.

00:52:03: sleep and health are wildly connected.

00:52:06: so when I talk about sleep optimization were talking about optimizing health its kind this Trojan horse effect Spitering is to all these other aspects of health.

00:52:20: How are we eating?

00:52:20: how We move in our bodies?

00:52:22: what's her stress load, you know All these things.

00:52:25: and that in turn supports great sleep.

00:52:29: Okay So I learned about the six ways.

00:52:31: first of all we had the light into dark.

00:52:34: then we have the sleep wake cycle.

00:52:35: number three was The temperature timing remember body temperature.

00:52:38: Then we had meal times and digestion exercise Timing and type and thought-timing.

00:52:46: First of all, I guess we need to see each other again because there are a million more questions.

00:52:49: They have about good sleep.

00:52:51: Oh great!

00:52:51: Okay amazing well i already feel very connected with you.

00:52:54: so... More to come

00:52:56: and second off.

00:52:57: also give this platform.. I'm wondering how do guys work when someone comes to sleep as skill what does it look like?

00:53:05: What's the typical type working with clients?

00:53:08: Yeah, absolutely.

00:53:09: Our aim is to have a lot of options no matter where people are at.

00:53:13: so if you're just kind of sleep curious and want some free information then you can go to SleepAsAskill.com And take a free sleep assessment and get information right away on what your dealing with.

00:53:26: You can sign up for our sleep newsletter that's been going out every Monday For over seven years called sleep obsessions.

00:53:31: So all kinds of information around the latest and greatest in sleep.

00:53:35: Then we have sleep Podcast episodes that are going on, tons of experts in the area of sleep and that's all available for free.

00:53:42: Then if people are looking for more support we have things like wearable audits so you can audit your aura rang, whoop band

00:53:49: etc.,

00:53:50: And ask a lot questions around what is happening with your sleep.

00:53:53: then go over it together.

00:53:55: We also have cohorts where they will be releasing new course coming up this year with some kind of hybrid, personalized things thanks to the beauty of AI.

00:54:06: We'll be able get more specific on where you are in a globe how much sunlight you need your Fitzpatrick scale.

00:54:12: all those things will kinda included.

00:54:14: And then for one-on-ones, we worked together with lots of lab testing and testing in general to see where your overall health is at.

00:54:25: And help usher you to improve sleep results measurably not just subjectively but of course we weren't subjective too.

00:54:33: That's awesome!

00:54:33: My last question today the following If I was about ask your husband what Molly free Madrid, and all this experience of pre-sleep optimization.

00:54:44: And post-optimization looks like?

00:54:46: What would he

00:54:47: answer?".

00:54:47: Oh my god!

00:54:49: He'd say night in day for me and him because now it's wild... Because both us lived like poker players essentially.

00:54:59: He was a character himself as psychology professor at a CUNY background in forensics high six poker player.

00:55:05: hence the poker crossover has done all kinds of studies.

00:55:09: He's a body language expert, so breaks down body language at the poker table and beyond... So we were very obsessive personalities!

00:55:17: And we would be very justified and righteous about going to bed super late because then you'd say well we get our best work done like lay in the morning.

00:55:25: But now both us rise with the sun.

00:55:29: I think he's just as shocked as i am that we live this lifestyle Because one of the reasons, he became an entrepreneur so he didn't have to wake up.

00:55:40: To an alarm i mean So The fact That it's rippled into his life too is crazy.

00:55:48: but He would also say a much more militant about lights than he Is?

00:56:00: But yeah, so the connections.

00:56:03: but we're just talking about literally last night that it's become such a nice kind of ritual and anchor because We need these rituals in anchors.

00:56:11: And we were just talking how left to our own devices?

00:56:30: Molly, it was really a pleasure.

00:56:32: Thanks for all of this because you know every single of the six dimensions here is so full of knowledge and things to look at.

00:56:39: And yeah go different way in life.

00:56:41: So as I said looking forward to talking again All the best of luck and thanks a lot.

00:56:46: Oh well thank you so much Jules!

00:56:48: We appreciate your time.

00:56:51: Well maybe there's one thought from this episode You'd like take with you into everyday life Something that can accompany you Because This Is What This Next Level Journey Is About to support your growth and place people & perspectives at your side along the way.

00:57:05: And if you'd like stay on this path with us, subscribe to our podcast.

00:57:09: Oh!

00:57:09: And a five star rating helps make these conversations more visible.

00:57:13: Thanks for being part of this journey.

00:57:14: See ya in next stage.